Utah Utes linebacker Devin Lloyd (20) runs for a touchdown after intercepting a pass during a football game against the Oregon State Beavers at Reser Stadium in Corvallis, Ore., on Saturday, Oct. 12, 2019. Utah won 52-7. | Kristin Murphy, Deseret News
Fresh off bye weeks, Utah and UCLA return to the field Saturday at Rice-Eccles Stadium, both looking to claim the driver’s seat in the Pac-12 South. Ute Insiders Dirk Facer and Jody Genessy are joined by longtime Deseret News columnist Lee Benson to break down the game. The No. 8-ranked Utes are heavy favorites, while the Bruins, winners of three straight after a rough start to the season, have little to lose. The trio also talks hoops and discuss the Utes’ 94-point victory over Mississippi Valley State. How — and why — does that happen?
Dirk Facer: On this edition of the Deseret News Ute Insiders podcast is brought to you by Mr. Mac. Lee Benson joins Jody and I as we talk about Utah’s big game with UCLA this week. The winner is in the driver’s seat for the Pac-12 South. This and more, even a little basketball, on the Deseret News Ute Insiders podcast.
Welcome to yet another edition of the Deseret News Ute Insiders podcast brought to you by the good folks at Mr. Mac. I’m Dirk Facer, joined here in studio by Jody Genessy and our special guest, the legendary columnist Lee Benson. We’re glad to have you. Hey, guys, let’s jump right into football. Utah hosting UCLA this weekend. Both teams are coming off a bye. Does that matter, Lee? Is the team rusty or at this time of year could they just use the rest and heal up, like a Tyler Huntley, for example?
Lee Benson: Well I think the fact that they both have byes makes it pretty irrelevant. But it’s always good to rest up, especially football players, to have that extra week. It kind of has the makings of an early September game now. I think that both teams — if they’re not up for this game, and what’s Utah favored by? 21 or something like that? That gives UCLA something to chew on for two weeks and Utah looks at all these glittering compliments they’re getting so they can chew on that. It makes for a really, really interesting game. I think it’s the kind of game that needed a two-week build-up.
DF: Jody, obviously Utah comes in with an 8-1 record. UCLA comes in at 4-5 overall, yet the winner of this game will be in control of the Pac-12 South, you know, winning the tiebreaker head to head. It’s kind of strange for middle of November to have a team with a record like Utah’s going against a team like UCLA, but there’s a lot on the line this week.
Jody Genessy: Yeah. That shows you the interesting part about having a conference, you know. You can struggle early on and I actually like that, that a team can struggle early on, they rectify themselves, they get things going on a roll like UCLA has, and now they’ve showed that they’re one of the best Pac-12 teams and they can win the division just based on getting hot at the right time of the season. It’s interesting, we have UCLA at 4-2. They still play USC and Cal, so that’s going to be a big game after this Utah game. Utah has an easier path. They both control their own destiny, but Utah after this UCLA game plays Arizona and Colorado. So it sets up for kind of a South Division championship before a couple games are left to play. So it’s a really fun weekend.
DF: Lee, you kind of touched on it. Utah’s a heavy favorite and that. Are they going to get in their own way here or if they take care of business should they win this handily?
LB: Well, I think that’s a danger. A 21-point favorite. And then like Jody was talking about, it’s a little like the last four holes of the Masters. Anybody who thinks that this is going to stay status quo after this game, to me hasn’t followed the Pac-12 for the last however many years Utah’s been in it. Something weird is going to happen. I don’t think this will be a coronation game on Saturday, but it could be huge for Utah if they can pull this one out. But it’s a big target on your back when you’re up by 21 and getting all of the praise that they’re getting.
JG: That is such a big line for a team that comes out — obviously the 4-5 is, you know, UCLA doesn’t have a great record. But they’re playing really well. They beat Stanford on the road, they beat Arizona State — Arizona State was ranked 24th. They’re playing really well right now. They got a good quarterback, a good running back. That’s a lot of points.
LB: They have nothing to lose. Absolutely nothing. They’re supposed to lose, they have to play in Salt Lake, so that makes them dangerous. And they’ve got this hot coach that was drowning and now he’s the toast of the nation. Makes for an interesting storyline.
JG: You know, the LA Times had an interesting story this week. They said that since Chip Kelly’s taken over, 63 players have left the program at UCLA. And that’s delayed the, you know, I think a lot of people thought after what he did at Oregon that he’d turn UCLA around pretty fast and they said that it’s been stymied by the fact that’s a lot of guys to lose.
LB: That’s more than Utah basketball.
JG: He’s the Larry Krystkowiak of Pac-12 football.
DF: That’s why we have Lee here today. That’s a great point. But you know, that’s a phenomenal number to try to rebuild a program, and the fact that they are winning now. You know, Kyle Whittingham said at his press conference this week that maybe they’re discovering who they are now and starting to show that identity under Chip Kelly. But on paper, it looks like a mismatch. Like you said Lee, anything can happen in the Pac-12.
Speaking of the Pac-12 title game, Utah and Oregon appear to be on a collision course for that. How do you see that matchup, looking ahead very, very early and very prematurely. Kyle Whittingham would not like to hear what you have to say.
JG: I think it’s fun. I mean, both are ranked in the top 10 of the College Football Playoff rankings. And so it really is a playoff — it could be a play-in game for the playoffs and that would be elevate the interest even more. But they do appear to be on a collision course. And I think it’s pretty exciting.
DF: And the fact that both of them are in the top 10. I mean, that’s great for Larry Scott and the Pac-12. Utah goes to Tucson next week, which can be a dangerous place to play, and then the Colorado finale at home. I remember a few years ago Utah had a chance to go the Pac-12 title game and they lost to Colorado at Rice-Eccles Stadium. Are we looking maybe too much and saying boy, if they get past UCLA, it’s easy going? Or do you think they could trip up any of these last three games?
LB: I think they could trip up. And like I say, history suggests that somebody will and something different will happen. But I think the thing that Utah has going for it this year, in addition to this defense that is just like top five in everything. Top five in, you know, letting people out of the bathroom. I mean, it’s just like crazy good. And then the other thing that’s different than all the other years that we’ve seen the Utes of the Pac-12, is they’re winning games by like three and four touchdowns. And I think if you went back and looked at the record, the Utes have played so many one-score football games, and this year they haven’t had to do that. So it’s an indicator that maybe going to Arizona won’t be quite the nail-biter that it’s been in the past. But then again, early in the season we were looking at Colorado and Arizona and thinking hey, these guys are good football teams and they did have some good wins early on.
JG: Yeah, it’s just unfortunate that USC game. Gosh, right now it looks like it might bite them in the butt because that was the one slip-up. But since then it’s been an amazing wake-up call for the Utes and they’ve just been trouncing teams. Obviously the Washington game was a real hard fought one, but other than that they are just rolling through the Pac- 12. I’ll let Kyle Whittingham and his players take it one game at a time but I think this is a team that’s headed to the Pac-12 championship. I don’t see anybody stopping them.
LB: Well, Dirk, you’ve covered the Utes for a bunch of years. And you gotta have made some observations about the swagger this year versus other years.
DF: Yeah, it reminds me of ’04 and ’08. You know, the Fiesta Bowl team in ’04, remember, they steamrolled everybody. And we were writing our game stories at halftime because they were up by 35 points or 28 points. And like you mentioned the margin of victory. It reminds me a lot of ’04. ’08 they had some tight ones all along the way and they still won the games. But it was interesting, after the Sugar Bowl team I did a story and talked to a bunch of the players or coaches and that that had been involved with both teams and asked them which team was better. And of course, the ’04 guys like their team, the ’08 guys like their team. And now we got to throw these guys maybe if they become the first Rose Bowl team from Utah. Lee, I’m going to throw this back at you because you’ve seen a lot of football around here. Where do you think — if this team is able to go 12-1 and go the Rose Bowl, will they go down as one of the greatest teams in the state of Utah? And I’m talking with BYU’s national championship team, Utah’s Fiesta and Sugar bowl teams. Can you throw them in that category?
LB: Oh, for sure. I mean, maybe the best ever, you know, depending on how you want to rank things. But they’ve had a legitimate schedule. They’ve got a legitimate defense. They’ve beaten some legitimate opponents. If they go 12-1, yeah, I think we have to rank them as good or maybe the best of all time.
JG: I kind of want to see what they do. I mean, obviously, if they go 12-1 they would have to probably beat Oregon in that Pac-12 championship game. I want to see who they beat in the Rose Bowl, assuming it’d be the Rose Bowl. They’re gonna have a really good opponent, but they had a little bit of a weak preseason schedule. I want the BYU game to be continued, but I like that they’ve got Florida on the schedule in the future. I think they need to beef that up. And if they would have beat another really good team in the preseason, I think I’d be a little higher on this as far as that the all-time perspective. It’s hard to say they’re better than that 2008 team, but I think that a 12-1 team would stack right up against either of those two teams. Let’s get our math straight, you know, if they win the Pac-12 championship game and the Rose Bowl they’re 13-1. That’s rare around here. Obviously Utah had the undefeated teams and BYU a national championship team, but 13-1 in this modern era is good. And that defense, the rush defense, No. 1 in the nation. I haven’t checked this week, but the week before they were 12 yards better than any team in the nation. I mean, they’re not just the best rush defense. They are by a margin. And that says something. And then Tyler Huntley is playing as well as any quarterback in the country.
LB: Well and to even help the storyline for this week that UCLA has the top rusher in the Pac-12. And so will they be able to stay where they are as a rushing defense?
JG: Yeah, and then that leads to who will get more yards? Will Zack Moss rise to the occasion? He’s No. 2 in rushing in the conference, yards per game. And he obviously had that short game against USC where he was injured. But we’re going to have two of the best running backs in and two pretty good rush defenses. This should be a good one. Do you think the playoff is a dream? Is it a pipe dream? I mean, I know Ute fans get excited about it and the fact that it’s Tuesday so the second rankings will come out tonight. We don’t have them with us but they’re No. 8 in the first one. Is that a pipe dream to think they could slip into the top four by the end of the season?
JG: A little bit. I mean, if they wouldn’t have slipped up against USC, they were like in prime position. They were in the top 10 in the polls, not in the college football playoff rankings, but playoff rankings. They were primed just to make a playoff run at that point. Everybody was thinking well, they’re going to slip up because they traditionally do and they have their November struggles. But if they would have beat USC I think they would would be in such a good position. It’s going to be really tough because Minnesota is just coming on strong. I could see them leapfrogging the Utes. It’s going to be hard for teams in front of them right now to slip behind them. Either way, it’s just a fun ride to the end of the season, whether they go the Playoff or the Rose Bowl. Do you think if Utah or Oregon runs the table, one of them ends up 12-1 before the playoffs or the bowl game, does the Pac-12 deserve to have one of the four teams in there? Or do you think an Alabama or another SEC team — they’ll get two in and or maybe even the Big Ten. I like Kyle Whittingham’s approach that in a perfect world all five conference champions would be included in the playoff, and maybe three at large teams or something. But it is what it is now. It’s a four-team playoff. Does a 12-1 one Pac-12 champion deserve to be in it?
LB: I’ll say right now, I’ll go online because I don’t have anything to lose, but Utah is in if they go 12-1. There aren’t too many teams they have to pass up now. Alabama now all of a sudden has a loss. And I go back and I hate to add up how big of a math challenge, but I go back to 1984 when BYU was rolling along and I swear we had these same conversations among the sports staff. This had to happen and this had to happen and this had to happen and it all happened. Well just this weekend, it seemed to me like the things that really needed to happen, a couple of them happened. Alabama lost, Penn State lost, theoretically tonight Utah could be all the way up to No. 6 and then you just got to have — and Ohio State’s still got to play Michigan. There’s a lot that’s going to happen. So yeah, getting way down the road, if Utah can go go 12-1 and beat a good Oregon team I think they’re in for sure.
JG: Good points, Lee. The thing about a four-team playoff, I don’t think a conference should have more than one representative. I just don’t. Especially if it’s the SEC. BYU beat an SEC team this year, so come on. No seriously, like four teams. I completely agree with Kyle Whittingham. It should be at least an eight-team playoff. Power Five conferences should all be represented. Absolutely exactly, and then I would say the best Group of Five teams should be in as well and then two at-large teams.
LB: They should have given it to us a long time ago. We would have had that figured out so many years ago.
JG: I have a feeling the SEC had something to do with the current structure. What do you think? The SEC, they play cupcakes in the preseason and then they just beat up on each other. And then they lose to BYU? Come on.
DF: Hey, come on Tennessee. All right. Anything else on football, guys, before we turn our attention to the hardwood? I will take that as a no. All right, let’s transition. The Utah basketball men’s team is off to a 2-0 start. Their last game they set an NCAA record with a 94-point victory over Mississippi Valley State. I don’t know about you guys, but I thought that was disrespectful to the game, disrespectful to the opposition.
JG: You’re right, Mississippi Valley State should have played better.
DF: Yeah, well, you know, the bottom line is why schedule a team and charge fans to come see a game that you’re going to win by 94 points? I think that’s where the discussion starts. Why are they playing a team they can beat by 94 points?
LB: But then it quickly escalates to why beat a team by 94 points? Why score 70 something in each half and rub it in an actual college program that much. I don’t know how much buzz there has been around the country about that, but beating anybody by 94 points is pouring it on, no matter how you slice it.
JG: I remember at church ball, that reminds me of when I was a deacon and the priests from the 8th Ward were coming at us. They’re like trying to score 100 points, we had like 20. They’re dunking on us. Brings back bad memories.
JG: I’ve got a word I’ll bet you never never even heard of, Jody. Assist. Assist
DF: If you didn’t do all the shooting maybe you guys would have come a little closer.
JG: You’re just trying to kiss up to John Stockton now. I mean, they were pouring it on but they had nine guys in double figures. So they were spreading it around. Plus, they have 11 freshmen on their team, they need to play some teams that they can beat.
DF: To win by 94 points, though? What did they really get out of that game? Could they have done something like let’s work on our offense with 20 seconds to go on the shot clock. Pass the ball around and then we’ll start the set at 20 seconds, or start at 15 seconds, start at 10. There’s ways they could have killed the clock a little bit and then got some beneficial work out of it. So you know, what if we’re inbounding the ball with 10 seconds to go. Why couldn’t they do more situational things?
JG: My little son plays lacrosse and when Park City would go up on — Lee’s mean Park City kids — when they would go up double digits on us in lacrosse, that’s exactly what the coach would do. He would, instead of just going in and scoring, he’d make the kids start doing two passes and then they had to do three passes before they can shoot. Maybe work on some different things. I don’t know, to me it sounds like Utah’s trying to get style points so they can get in the NCAA Tournament.
LB: There is a formula. I guess how many you beat people by factors into whether you get in the tournament. They might already be in.
DF: I can just see the committee going, you know they did beat Mississippi Valley State by 94, maybe we should put them in.
JG: So this is the biggest win of all time, so this is the greatest basketball team of all time. The Utes, who knew?
DF: They’ve got a tough challenge later this week with Minnesota coming into the Huntsman. That will give them a good challenge, a Big Ten team. Good for the Utes and all that, but it surprised me.
LB: You think they covered the spread on Mississippi?
JG: I saw some guys at Crown Burger that looked like they had taken advantage of that line and had a big payday. But you know, I just thought that was too much. And you can say couldn’t call the dogs off and all that. But I think there’s some situational things and respect to your opposition. I just don’t think beating anybody by 94 is respecting the game or the opposition in the way that we’re accustomed to around here.
JG: Utah’s a basketball state and frankly, I just think we don’t do that around here. Mississippi Valley State, they came here last year and got trounced by BYU, I believe Utah State, and Utah, so they’re getting some money. They know what they’re in for. I don’t think they were in for it for a 94-point loss. I’m not as offended as you guys are. I say let the kids play.
DF: Olympus High product Rylan Jones is off to a great start as quarterback in that Utah team, the point guard and that. Do you see a bright future for him, Lee? I mean, he’s a local guy. Is that going to spur more interest in the program to have some local guys?
LB: Well they keep getting those Olympus guys and I think so. I think that Utah has done a pretty good job of getting the local guys and if they can keep them and and move forward with that, obviously everybody in the Utah program this year has an opportunity because it’s such a young team and they’re kind of starting from scratch. So again, this may be just the ticket for Utah to get some momentum and turn the corner because they’ve been a little bit stuck on that corner for a couple of years.
JG: Yeah, I think you touched on it earlier as well, Lee, joking about Krystkowiak and the turn ver. That’s the key here with this team. They’ve got some young talent, they’ve got some nice players, plus they have like, I believe the sixth-highest ranked recruiting class right now for 2020. So they’ve got some talent in the system, some talent ready to be infused into the system. They just need to keep these guys together. So Coach K needs to figure out how to keep guys in there.
DF: Jody, you covered the Jazz for several years, and all that. This town has become a Jazz town now. Can the Utes ever make some headway and get some crowds back up on the Hill? Is winning the ticket?
JG: I mean, not if they’re only going to win by 94 points. That’s a tough sell because even when they play well the Huntsman Center just isn’t very full. And so it’s going to take some consistent years of winning. Utah is a basketball state but it’s also a bandwagon state. We love winners. And so I think that if the Utes can continue to win, show that they’re a quality NCAA team every year and not just maybe an NIT team, maybe an NCAA team every five or six years. They need to be NCAA every year, a Pac-12 championship contender every year, and then I think the fans will come back.
DF: Lee, will Utah make the NCAA Tournament this year? They’ve missed it the last three years.
LB: No, I don’t think they will because they’ve got all those things going against them and they play a pretty darn good Pac-12 league. But what Jody was just talking about, I think it ebbs and flows. I can remember when Utah wasn’t drawing flies to their football game. That wasn’t that many years ago, and if you get a Jimmer Fredette or you get a Rick Majerus or you get a program that just catches fire, then they start filling all the seats up in the basketball arena and maybe the football team doesn’t sell as many. It’s just cyclical and it’s been down for a while. And it is true. But you know one of the great things about it? I like to go to Utah basketball games and I like to find a seat and it’s pretty easy to find one.
JG: Nice and cozy, stretch your legs out. If only they had waiter service you wouldn’t even have to go up the stairs to go get a drink, right? Where Lee sits they do.
DF: Yeah, for the Park City crowd.
LB: Hey, hey, I’m a newspaper guy. Give me your per diem, Dirk, then I’ll be OK.
DF: We’ll split it, how’s that? It’s so generous we can get two hot dogs and two drinks maybe.
LB: That’s why we all got into this business. They pay you to watch sports and write about them and they give you food.
DF: Free parking, free seat, free food, free everything. Hey, time now to turn things over to our friend Tom Barberi and Jody.
JG: This week on the Utah by 5 segment we are going to retouch on the Utah basketball win over Mississippi Valley State. Just an insane game. First off, Utah’s 94-point margin of victory broke the NCAA record set back on Dec. 7, 1995. So that’s been around for a while. Tulsa, as I’m sure everybody knows, defeated Prairie View A&M 141-50.
DF: Timeout. Famous Utah athlete that went to Prairie View. Who was it?
JG: That would be Ron Boone
DF: Nope. No. 31, Utah Stars center.
LB: Zelmo Beatty
JG: Now I feel bad sorry. Ron’s Idaho State, right?
DF: Yeah, Boone was an Idaho State-Pocatello guy.
JG: Okay, I know his son went back east to Nebraska.
LB: Well Ron Boone was from Omaha.
DF: That’s true, originally an Omaha guy.
JG: It’s all coming together. No. 2, the Utes had two players have triple-doubles. Both Gach and Rylan Jones. I get the Jones name. So Rylan Jones became just the second freshmen ever to record a triple-double in Pac-12 Conference history. He had 10 points, 10 rebounds and 11 assists in just his second college game. Even if it’s the worst team in the country, that’s impressive.
DF: He was also the first guy to do it in a 94-point victory.
JG: He is setting history. The last Utah player to register a triple-double, you know who it was?
LB: Alex Jensen. He had 16 points, 11 rebounds, 10 assists vs Fresno State back in 1999. No. 3, Mississippi Valley State honored — this was a tweet, I should say. Mississippi Valley State honored its former player Jerry Rice by scoring 49 points. Mike Clown on Twitter. Mike Clown said he had Mississippi Valley State plus 93.5. So rough day in Las Vegas for that man.
And the final one was that alone should get them into the College Football Playoff. So there you go. Maybe that is what the Utes needed.
So hey, we have the Ute Insiders newsletter every Wednesday, you can subscribe at deseret.com. We have lots of goodies, the Utah by five and a lot of other fun stuff to read.
DF: Jody does a great job with that. So I encourage everyone to sign up for that. Let’s wrap this up. Any parting shots, anything you want to say about the game this week? Lee, how do you see it? Do you think Utah will win by 21 or more points?
LB: I don’t think so. I think it’s gonna be a cold day. I think that that might factor into things. I think UCLA’s got all kinds of momentum and reasons to play. I think Utah will win but I’ll take the under.
JG: This does seem like a week where it could be a scary game for the Utes, so I will be very impressed if they can cover the spread. Can we say I would bet under? I would bet under if I were a betting man, hopefully management realizes that I’m not, of course.
DF: Well, speaking of spread, what do you think they’re going to feed us?
JG: I’m hoping some R&R Barbecue maybe.
DF: Is that enticing enough to get you up there, Lee?
LB: I’ll be there, of course, in spirit.
JG: I’m trying to get R&R to sponsor us. So there you go. I’ll take any barbecue. I think Lee’s been to enough ballgames in his life to pretty much sample every offering that they give to the media for food.
LB: I enjoy a good press box meal. I also enjoy a good game when it’s in the 30s on TV.
JG: It’ll be a balmy 70 degrees in the press box.
DF: Guys, just a reminder for Utah fans that there’s soccer, volleyball, cross country, a lot of sports going on up on the Hill.
JG: Soccer’s in the NCAA tournament.
DF: I think their friends down south are also in, right?
JG: Yeah BYU went undefeated this year, so nice season for both soccer programs.
DF: Ute fans, don’t get on Jody for bringing that point up. It was just a fact.
JG: It was just a fact. But Utah soccer plays Duke. And you know, I studied up on Utah soccer. Utah volleyball just had a four-game sweep over UCLA and USC for the first time in history as well. I’m all here for the Olympic sports. Thank you very much.
DF: And we would love to have updates on the Olympic sports every week.
JG: Ute Insiders newsletter. Come on.
LB: That’s what you call job security, Jody.
DF: Not that we need it in this business, right? We’re good for 20, 30 more years easy.
Hey folks, I want to thank you for listening. I want to thank Kent and Richie for putting the show on behind the scenes. Thank Lee and Jody for being our co-hosts this week. Guys, it’s been a pleasure putting this on with you. And as always folks, we’ll talk to you later.
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